How to Resonate as a Leader with Enrico Biscaro

Enrico: [00:00:00] Resonance is energy to me, and obviously your job is not to destroy anyone, but to vibrate with the same energy the person has. So the effect is multiplied and you can increase the energy of a person through resonating with them, and you can resonate with somebody if you are empathetic, if you listen empathically.

So a resonance to me, it’s very important in leadership because when you resonate is where you can have big breakthrough. 

Carolyn: Enrico Biscaro believes that the fastest way to success is serving others, and that leadership takes courage. He’s traveled the world as an accomplished leader and for 15 years mentored, coached.

And touched the lives of countless people, helping them become the best version of themselves and achieve [00:01:00] their dreams. He is an MBA graduate with Beta Gamma Sigma honors. He coached over 31st time managers, five of now global or regional executive roles leading multi-million dollar portfolios. His focus is on repeatable performance, and he does not send emails.

Else after 5:00 PM and always takes a four week vacation.

In my conversation with Enrico, we’re gonna talk about this notion of resonance On his website, he states that the limitlessness of what your team can achieve is your resonance as their leader. Resonance has a variety of meanings. One of those meanings refers to a vibration of large amplitude in a [00:02:00] system caused by a small periodic stimulus.

What the heck does that have to do with leadership? I’m curious. I hope you share that curiosity with me, and you’ll find out a little bit more about this notion of resonance as a leader and how you. Can use it along with energy to really ensure that your impact as a leader is driving positive change. I hope you enjoy our discussion.

Intro: Welcome to Evolve a new era of leadership, a podcast for real leaders to join real conversations with business experts, practitioners thought leaders, and change makers who integrate head, heart, and body in all they do, who commit to compassion and curiosity, who commit to radical [00:03:00] self-leadership in their quest to understand others better too, because the only way to deliver.

Real results is to understand what it takes to lead real human beings. This is a new era of leadership.

Carolyn: I’m Carolyn Suarez, and this is Evolve a new era of Leadership. Hello, evolve listeners, welcome back for another episode of Evolve, a New Era in Leadership, and today’s guest is coming to us. From another country, not Canada. Today’s guest is Enrico Biscaro. Welcome to the show, Enrico. 

Enrico: Thank you very much, Carly, for having me and for giving an opportunity to have a discussion with you.

Carolyn: Yeah, and I know we’ve got a bit of a time change here going on. Where are you joining us from today? What part of the world? From British [00:04:00] Columbia. Okay. I thought it was going to be more exotic than that because I remember a conversation about how much you love to travel, so that’s where I’m getting lost.

I was thinking somewhere much more exotic. 

Enrico: Well, it’s funny you mentioned, because for me, where I am now, it’s quite exotic. I am in the middle of British Columbia in a small town called Chatwin, where I am doing a project for the company I’m currently working for. And so it’s extremely exotic because I have years in my backyard.

And the nature around us is absolutely fantastic for someone that has lived this past 20 years in big cities. So I consider myself in a very exhausted place. 

Carolyn: Wow. And I know when we talked, when we met, you really referenced how travel and your love of travel helped you in leadership and [00:05:00] gave you perspective.

And so maybe if you could just share a little bit about how traveling. Gave you some of these important lessons in leadership. 

Enrico: Trouble makes you extremely uncomfortable, especially if you start at a young age as a diet led by my parents, of course, makes you uncomfortable because you don’t sleep in your room because you don’t eat the food you’re used to.

You meet people that don’t speak your language. And travel requires what leadership requires every day to get out of your comfort zone one and two to adapt to the people around you. Yeah. So I think that travel certainly shaped my leadership style. 

Carolyn: And you started traveling, I’m guessing, at a young age.

Where have you been through the 

Enrico: world? I have an app that keeps track with that. I’ve not traveled extensively in Eastern [00:06:00] Europe and Latin America. Hmm. Going by exclusion. Those are the two place in the world that have not traveled much, but Europe, north America, Southeast Asia. The Middle East parts to Africa.

It’s a big place. I don’t consider myself someone that has traveled the entire world, but it’s not just about travel. You know, when I was young, okay, you go on vacation for a month, you go to one place to go to another, but then when I start traveling for work, you start living in a different place. And so you spend two years in Bahrain.

And then I spent two years in Israel. That was a great experience because I went from a. Muslim country working in Saudi Arabia. Into Israel. Right. Mm. Which is really kind of at the opposite. Right? Right. And still you find there that eventually what people wants the value are the same no matter what they tell [00:07:00] you on CNN or, or other, you know, Fox News or whatever.

The thing that unite us are as human beings are way. Bigger than the things that divides us or supposedly divide us because I, I really think that that’s a narrative that is pushed because of. Interest, not because it’s true, and I, I can make example. You know, in the end, everybody wants their children to be healthy.

They want their children to be successful, right? They care about their elderly. They want to be happy. These are guaranteed people don’t want to go to war. People want to have a job that fulfill them. The basic needs are the same no matter where they are. And I think. Looking at leadership. No matter where you are in the world, you can find commonality with people.

And no matter where you are in your leadership journey, you can find commonality with a person that needs your [00:08:00] support. And I say it needs your support because leadership, for me, service in one word, you are there to serve others. 

Carolyn: Yeah. And so there’s a real perspective that you gain traveling and working through different parts of the world to see that humanity in action.

And like you said, we all kind of have similar values at the end of the day, want similar things. If we sort of. Break down all the different sort of political and religious things that might separate us or you know, identity sort of things as well. So in our conversation when we first, as I said, when we first met, we talked a lot about your travel and perspective.

We talked about storytelling as well as a powerful tool for leadership. And I know that you’ve just recently. Released a book called Resonance Stories and Strategies for Global Team Breakthroughs. Can you tell us a little bit about what inspired you to write that book? 

Enrico: What inspired me to write the book is that [00:09:00] another of those desire, which is I think innate in everyone to leave a small trace.

From the person who put his hand on the cave and spray some paint to leave his mark to, to the guy that build the pyramids or the birds, find Dubai. You know, we all want to leave a trace and, and my trace is certainly is not gonna be a big pyramids or a great invention or not much. But if somebody reads this book and it resonates with a person in his leadership journey, then I would’ve left my trace and I would be happy with 

Carolyn: that.

Hmm. And so resonance, and I know that the cover, the last cover that I saw, I’m not sure if it ended up being the final cover, was very stunning. It w it had some beautiful colors in it. Definitely the sense of like a circle or sort of this sense of roundness, what, you know, I kind of think of team dynamics when I think of that.

Can you tell us why resonance, what does resonance mean and why is it the title [00:10:00] of your book? 

Enrico: Because resonance is very powerful. If you think about the opera singer that breaks the glass, she does it through she or he, you know, does it through resonance. Actually, this is related to a story. When I did my first training course, when I joined the second company I worked for, I was hired as a drilling engineer.

And so they teach you about what happened when you drill the hole. And one of the big problem you have is resonance because if you put your drill string or a big steel tub in resonance you, you’re gonna break everything. So resonance is a very powerful force and you’re that course, they show out this video of their breach.

It’s a famous, the Common Arrow Bridge in the United States. A very light breeze caused the breach to collapse because, At that time, the concept was not very well understood. So the bridge went into resonance [00:11:00] and it got destroyed. Mm. So resonance is energy to me, and obviously your job is not to destroy anyone, but to vibrate with the same energy the person has.

So the effect is multiplied and you can increase. The energy of a person through resonating with them. And you can resonate with somebody if you are empathetic, if you listen empathically. So a resonance to me, it’s very important in leadership because when you resonate is where you can have big breakthrough.

Carolyn: Mm. Yeah, absolutely. Say a little bit more, like, I know you commented about resonance is about vibrating and being in tune with others and energy is infinite when you resonate with somebody from a content perspective, what do you write about in the book? What do you share with readers about resonance and energy?

I [00:12:00] think that 

Enrico: everybody resonates to to stories, right? Stories are what they made us, our culture. That’s what we are. Told when you go to bed when you’re a child. So basically the book, it’s a little story, personal story. Yep. And from that story, there’s a leadership lesson to be taken. Right? Right. So for example, I talk about resilience, which I think is an important thing to build in your team, you know?

Yep. When, when you lead. And so I tell the story about my two grandmothers, they both lived in very different time and one. Went through two World War Spanish Flu. The second one, she was born in the middle of the Spanish flu and she had only one World War. And so they were telling me their story and they’ve always been extremely resilient and I’ve learned resilience from them.

One, my grandmother was kidnapped during the Second World War. Wow. So she was kidnapped. She was a teacher and she was [00:13:00] kidnapped by the casa, which were from the Eastern Europe. So she could not speak the language. The only words she knew in in their language was teachers. So she said, I’m a teacher. So the soldier, instead of taking her only knows where they took her to the director of the school district and the director that I’d known my grandmother only once.

She’s a teacher. And they let her go. And this goes back to the thing that makes us common. You know, they let her go because she was a teacher and because there’s a respect for teacher cuz they take care of your children because they serve the community and so they let her go. And so that’s one of the story that’s in the book.

And so, yes, my grandmother told me about being resilient and then I was thinking about. Me complaining that I was in quarantine during the Covid, right? Mm-hmm. And working and watching Netflix, et cetera. And then I was stopped [00:14:00] thinking about my grandmother and all the people that lived through the war and said, well, I have really no rights to, to complain.

You know, when you put things in perspective, that’s an example of what I write in the book. Right? 

Carolyn: Yeah. So that was chapter one. I believe it was chapter one or chapter two, I think it was Chapter one. Yes. And you’ve got 31 stories in here. What was the hardest lesson for you to learn or like the hardest story for you to share with the readers?

Enrico: One of the hardest story that was difficult for me to share was we lived in the States for three years, and I share a story of, you know, one day my daughter came back from school crying. She was seven at the time, so she’s a kid, and so we asked. You know, what’s going on? Why, why are you crying? And, and she said, well, eventually, you know, they asked me if I go to church.

I said that I don’t believe in God. And they told me that you will burn in hell and you have no show. Right? Mm. [00:15:00] And so this is kids that are six or seven years old that really. You think about, okay, you know, obviously this behavior does not come from the kids. You cannot really blame the kids, right? And so you see a word where there’s an immediate closure to somebody that is different, right?

In this case, different religion or or belief sets. And that made us very uncomfortable living in that. Place where we were at the time, and that was a difficult story to share because usually we adapted very well everywhere we went. Those here were difficult to integrate in a society which is very close from the beginning.

You know, where people certainly are very nice, very, very friendly from the exterior, but the minutes they feel that you are not like them. Then there’s this closure. You know that all the doors shuts, right? [00:16:00] They’re still. Places in the world that function with this type of behavior. Right. And adapting to those is difficult, but you need to adapt, you know?

Carolyn: Yeah, yeah. So I’m guessing that was the sort of lesson, is the importance of adaptability in that 

Enrico: chapter. Correct? Yes. In that chapter is the important to, uh, that ability to, to every situation you encounter, even the more difficult, you know? Mm. 

Carolyn: Yeah. Now, I’m kind of curious. One of these chapters is titled Rats or Ticklish.

Um, I’m not a big fan of rats myself, so I’m kind of curious about how you found out that rats are ticklish. 

Enrico: Well, there was a study that happy rats, if you make, uh, rats happy or smiling, they’re, they’re more productive and they can do task more efficiently. Right? Mm. Then, and I think, um, the lesson there is that it’s important for you as a leader to always have a smile on your face, you know, regardless of.

What goes through your day when you face your team [00:17:00] or difficulties, you need to be able to go in with a smile. Mm. Because your, and back to resonance, you know, this is very, very relative to resonance. Whatever is on your face will just resonate with the people in front of you and they will mimic that.

You know, we are very social animal. We mimic the behavior of the other people. So you as a leader, You cannot really afford to have a bad day, so to speak. Mm. One of the nicest compliment that that I received was from someone that it was a very difficult situation, one of the many, and, and eventually said, you know, Rico, what I really like about you is that no matter how deep in trouble we are, you always make us laugh, and that’s why then we can.

90% of the time solve the problem. Right. And if we don’t, we know that there’s no consequences for us. Right? Right. So I think it’s extremely important for a leader to be always [00:18:00] smiling. And then this brings to another consideration that is not easy to do. You talk about leadership and, and trauma. So it’s very important for the leader to manage her own energy as 

Carolyn: well.

Right? Right. 

Enrico: So you need to take care of yourself very often before you take care of your team. And that’s why I always say, you know, A leader needs to manage energy, not time. Your role as a manager is managing time. You know, you need to manage a task and time. The, the shift between management and leadership, when now your leader managing the energy is way more important.

Yeah. The energy of the team, but first, just like on a plane, you know, put your oxygen mask first. Yeah. That needs to be from the center of your leadership journey, because if you burn down, well, The clean is gonna crush. 

Carolyn: Yeah. So there’s a few things you, you said in there. I wanna, I wanna ask more about, so I wanna circle back to the [00:19:00] perspective you shared about being happy or putting a smile on your face.

So I know there are people, there’s a school of thought out there that, well, not even just a school of thought, like a lot of evidence around toxic positivity. Being sort of detrimental, and so I’m curious how you would position what you said to this notion of toxic positivity. 

Enrico: Putting a smile on your face every morning does not mean that you cannot show vulnerability.

Yep. Okay. When you make an example, you take your story and you make your story, but in reality, you want to be 80% of the time like that. And then because when you’re, that, that allows you to show vulnerability without Yes. Showing weakness. Yeah. Right. So what I used to do is, okay, I’m, I have a bad day. I know I have a day.

I go to work, [00:20:00] I start a day with a smile on my face, and I show that I am full of energy. I’m ready to go, and we’re gonna fix the problem. Right? Yeah. But that never prevented me to have a one-to-one conversation with my senior leadership and say, Hey, you know, I. We have a problem. I’m feeling it. I’m feeling the stress, I’m feeling the nervousness.

Yeah, and, and that’s a different conversation when you lead. You also know your team and you have different level of interaction with different personality. But let’s say you get into the office and need to walk through the corridor, and you have from this. Literally from the janitor, the last people that you hired and your senior leader, you know, they all need to see that You smile.

Yeah. Then you can have the other conversation at different level. 

Carolyn: Here’s what I hear, Enrico, and I’m really glad that we’re making this differentiator for the listeners cuz I didn’t think that you were presuming that we have to be happy and force happiness. No, but a [00:21:00] smile. Can create a sense of safety.

It can be an indicator to other parties that, hey, this is safe. Right? It’s safe, welcoming. It’s not going to necessarily promise safety, but it’s an indicator that could signal that, and that I think is what opens the door. Well, not, I think, I know that that’s what opens the door. For vulnerability and welcoming that conversation with others.

So I’m glad we made that distinction cuz I, I don’t think it’s just happy. It’s, it’s just creating, like I said, it’s an indicator of. This is safe. I wanna hear from you. I wanna interact with you. I absolutely agree. Along with other things, obviously, I don’t wanna say like, Hey, you just go smile and everybody’s gonna, you know, think that everything’s safe.

But, um, now the other thing that you said there too, which is around energy and great leaders manage energy, not time. How did you learn that lesson for yourself? Is there a story in there that helped you really embody that thing? 

Enrico: Uh, [00:22:00] yes, for sure. I mean, I. I failed to do that in the place in my career and, and the consequences.

I dragged them with me for many years in term of, in term of, um, high level stress, anxiety. So I made that mistake to manage my energy. And so I say that, uh, from a direct, uh, consequences of a painful personal experience, or you find yourself working 14, 15, 16 an hour per day, you’re not well supported. A lot of pressure and you think that, If you don’t do certain things, you’re inadequate, career might suffer or you might lose your job.

And that’s a vicious circle that unless you are very aware of your limits and you put a stop by managing the energy right. Seeing that your batteries are drained. I say, okay, I need to stop. No matter what happened. You know, I need to stop because my [00:23:00] battery needs recharging. That’s something that unfortunately they don’t teach you in leadership school, right?

Mm-hmm. The models are you. Especially, I must say this day, you know when, when you have very famous CEO going around saying, oh, you know, I sleep in the office, and the hustle culture, et cetera, where this type of behavior is rewarded. It’s difficult to learn these on your own. It’s important to have this conversation, and if you have young listeners that are just started their leadership path, et cetera, you know, do not trust your instinct.

Do not trust your gut. You’ll get to a point where you’ll burn out and stop before you do that. That would be my advice. 

Carolyn: What sort of practices or things would you recommend to people to help or what worked for you? I will, 

Enrico: I will not, uh, suggest Cold Bath every day or meditation. That has never worked for me.

Yep. Quite frankly, I run Mm, okay. [00:24:00] So running is my meditation, if you will. Yep. I cannot stand still for five minutes. That’s, that’s one of the thing I carry over from my childhood. But I can run, and when I run, that’s where I charge my battery. Nice, nice. But this is a very personal thing, how you recharge your batteries.

Yes. I think breathing techniques are, are important. You know, if you, you can learn one of those, you can get one of those app that, yep, you, you have today, and I found that breathing technique works. So maybe you call that meditation and that’s okay. But. I’m not here to tell, oh, there’s a recipe you need to find what makes you recharge.

And it could be right painting, it could be, I dunno, writing poetry, whatever. 

Carolyn: Yeah. And so Enrico, what’s your hope? If somebody picks up this book and they read your stories, what action do you hope they take from reading it? Well, I 

Enrico: hope that [00:25:00] they have an open mind to say, I think I could try this and I would probably become a better leader.

Mm. 

Carolyn: Yeah. So again, 31 stories. There’s a lot in there. Are there certain themes out of these 31 stories that maybe you could give us a bit of a hint around, a little bit of a teaser into your book? 

Enrico: It goes from, uh, resilience, as we said into, we spoke a lot about managing energy. We spoke about creating habits.

Basically how to become a more effective leader for your team overall. 

Carolyn: Mm. Yeah. One of the things I loved about the piece that I read was just how relatable the story is, and it just sort of feels like I am. In that moment there with you and, and you know, you do a beautiful job at sort of bringing the reader into that story.

And in terms of storytelling as a leadership tool, is that something that you share with clients or that you hope [00:26:00] people can find their own ways to build a legacy around their own stories or? 

Enrico: I do share this with customer, and I think that back in the days where we were hunting and gathering food, and I don’t know why we lost this, but the strongest leader was not the person with the stronger arm or the best ability to hunt.

The stronger leader was the person that was telling the best story, right? You can be. Fantastic leader, but if you cannot teach other how to lead or you can be a fantastic hunter, but if you cannot teach other people how to hunt, then you are not really effective in the situation where you survival back in the days or having a successful business.

And it’s true story, I think that. You can achieve the biggest resonance with other people, not by telling. And the example I always make, you know, I think [00:27:00] I was known in my company, I said it many times, don’t use an agenda in PowerPoint. I’m not interested. I know why you’re here for, I know what you’re talking about.

Tell me a story. Yeah. In the first slide, you need to tell me a story that relates to the agenda and if the story is good. Trust me, I will buy whatever you’re telling me after slide one. Right? That’s how I tell people to use storytelling, you know, and, and a lot of people say, you know, I’m afraid to present, or I’m afraid to be in front of other people.

And, and I say, look, you know, when you are with me or when you are with the people you know, you’re very good at storytelling, so, Picture yourself telling a story, not giving a presentation, and that changes immediately. Not the psychologist or neuropsychology, but I’m sure that the switch from, oh, I need to present something.

To I am now telling a story. Yeah. [00:28:00] Must change your dynamic in your brain because you immediately become excited. Oh, I want to tell a story. Right? Everybody want to hear a story and everybody likes to tell the story. Yeah. Yeah. And so I think storytelling is, is very important in, in leadership because of that.

Carolyn: Enrico, where could our listeners find your book? Where, and if they want to learn more about you, where could they go? The 

Enrico: book is on Amazon, but before going to Amazon, you can go to ww dot resonance stories.com. We’ll make sure 

Carolyn: it’s in the show notes. So yeah, 

so, 

Enrico: and, and in, in that website you can access, uh, three chapter directly on the website or you can download a small PDF and then there, if you like what you see, you can go to Amazon and purchase the book.

Carolyn: That’s fantastic. So given the readers a good sort of sense of what you’re writing about and what you’re sharing. So Enrico, I usually end off the podcast by inviting the guest to answer three [00:29:00] questions. Are you game to answer these three questions of an evolved leader? Oh, absolutely. All right. All right, so the first one is around self-awareness.

Is there something that you could share with us that was a hard lesson to learn really uncomfortable, but gave you a lot of insight about yourself? 

Enrico: The most uncomfortable situation. I was let go of my job after 19 years. Mm. And of course that was not super comfortable, but I realized that when that happened, I realized that the fact that I never identified myself with my job, right, or my career, allow me to say, That’s okay.

The fact that I lost my job does not define me. And I think this is something that a lot of people do. I’ve seen it. A lot of people identify themselves with their career. Yeah. So when they lose [00:30:00] that, that becomes a very, very painful experience. I’ve seen it. I also have to let a few people go in my career.

So I’ve seen it and so. Realizing that your job, your career should never define who you are. You’re way more than what you do for a living. Yeah. It’s an important realization that I, I hope that the listener can have a, a reflection about. 

Carolyn: Yeah. Thanks Sanko. Uh, second question. We sort of talked a little bit this, we touched a little bit on it earlier in our conversation, but what is a practice or a ritual that you turn to, to help regulate your nervous system or bring you back into a state of regulation running?

Enrico: Yeah. Yes. We, we, we did say it’s, it’s, how many times a day do you run? Every other day, but they don’t run. I go to the gym. So [00:31:00] exercise in general. Right. But running is certainly better than going to the gym. Mm. But they say that you need to build some muscle at a certain age. So that’s what I’m trying 

to 

Carolyn: do.

And it sounds like given the beautiful landscape that you’re living within, that runs might be very therapeutic through nature as well. They 

Enrico: will be the path at the moment, the melting season here in Northern Canada. So there’s mud everywhere you can really run, but they will be, the sunrise are beautiful 

Carolyn: around here.

Yeah. Beautiful. Now last but not least, the final question has to do with our connection with others. And so this question is an invitation to share a song or a genre of music that makes you feel connected to something bigger than yourself. 

Enrico: It cannot be, but born to run, but it was spring. 

Carolyn: Hey, well you’re nothing if, if not consistent.

Enrico: I’m not making it up, but there’s actually a chapter in my book about think it’s [00:32:00] called, he was Born in the usa, right? Yeah. Yeah. Where I talk about my passion for Bruce Princeton and how if you see him as a storyteller, once again, not as a musician, he changed completely the perspective and now for three hours he can make a hundred thousand people resonate with his music and people at different ages, et cetera.

So, It looks like this thing about running a board, running a stage, but no, if it’s actually in the book. So it’s not something that, uh, Karen and I prepare carefully. It’s, it’s really 

Carolyn: me. Uh, that’s wonderful. Well, Enrico, is there, are there any last words or sage wisdom that you would like to impart on our listeners before we wrap up?

Enrico: No, I don’t consider myself as sage or have any particular wisdom, but just remember that leadership takes courage. Mm. 

Carolyn: Absolutely does a wonderful way to end things off. And you know, I think your book really shares stories [00:33:00] of, of that and really, uh, embodies what that statement says. So thank you so much for coming on the show today.

And, uh, do you have a run, like, after we’re done here or, you know, do you have some weights to go lift after we finish off? 

Enrico: Well, a, as a matter of fact, I woke up too early for running. So yes, I am going for a run after 

this 

Carolyn: absolute. We’ll let you, we’ll let you go run. Thank you so much, and thank you to, to all the listeners for tuning in to this episode, and we will have all of Enrico’s, uh, contact information and links to his book located in our show notes.

If you enjoyed our podcast today, please like and subscribe and leave a review for us. It really helps. Have a good day everyone. Thanks for tuning in. Here’s what’s resonating with me after my conversation with Enrico, and that is the power of storytelling and as leaders. How are [00:34:00] you using storytelling as a way to resonate with the people you work with?

Sometimes we can get caught up in thinking we have to have the best story or be a really charismatic storyteller, and that’s not necessarily the case. I hope our conversation today has inspired you to find some key learnings or key stories. That you could share with the people that you work with, that can build energy, can build some resonance and connection between you and the people that you work with.

As always, thank you so much for tuning in to our podcast, and if you are interested in more of the work that I do, please go to carolyn suarez.com. You can find my new book Evolve. The path to [00:35:00] trauma-informed leadership available there, as well as a few other packages you might wanna consider for your company or for your team.